Old cat vs. new cat -- how long can the fighting go on?

[Turkeycat]

Hello, yesterday a kitten followed me home and I want to ask about the compatibility of this kitten with the cat I already have. It's been one day and the old cat seems to be halfway curious and halfway hostile toward the kitten . The kitten looks about 4-6 months old and the cat is about a year old. There have been no big fights yet but there has been a lot of cornering, pawing, and hissing, all on the part of the old cat . They are both female and unspayed (I presume about the kitten, which is probably one of the many street cats that populate the area). How long can this stuff go on before I'm sure I should find a different home for the kitten? Do you think I can leave the cats alone together? I'm on holiday at the moment, so I am home all the time the next two days, and there is enough space in my place to separate the cats by a door if I need to go out. Do cats who are strangers get to like each other after awhile? How long can I hold on to the kitten before it would be psychologically damaging for it to be away from me? She's a sweet kitty and I'd like to keep her, but I'm fine with letting her go to keep the peace. Thanks for any advice you can give.

[Mona]

May I ask why you do not spay them? It is not a good idea to not spay for many reasons. Of course them getting impregnated and developing cancer of the uterus or an infection called pyometra.

This definitely would calm them down and make them friendly toward one another.

I recently adopted a kitten and have a 5 year old spayed female. It took them several weeks but finally they are getting along, and my older girl is mothering the kitten. Read link below:

http://www.cathelp-online.com/spayneuter.html

Mona, Honeybun and Little Chloe

[Stang]

I introduced a 1 yr old with my 10 yr old and was almost five years and they still had it out every day or so. They were both males so I don't know if that would make a differance. I would keep them apart untill the kitten can defend herself when you are not home to suppervise.

[Turkeycat]

Thanks for your replies. I have left the cats alone for several hours at a time with no bad results at all. It looks like the kitten is initiating the fighting sometimes, too, and it looks like playing to me. It never seems to get too serious. There is shrieking and pawing but no blood is ever drawn. I'm not going to worry about the situation.

Mona, I've been thinking about the spaying question tonight and I have checked out the helpful link you provided. However, I'm still not sure spaying is such a great thing. I'm not worried about my cats getting pregnant because there is no way they're going to leave my place. I am fiercely protective of them staying in my apartment and the man who looks after them when I go places for a long time now is very trustworthy and has shown me he will not let them out even though one of them likes to slip through one's feet as one comes in. I'm still not sure I want to have a vet put my cats to the knife, for a rather sizeable chunk of money, by the way, which of course is not my main concern, to reduce their risk of conditions of which I don't even know rates of occurrence (which I will be looking into) and risk of infection (I've heard some horror stories about vets, though mine seems good). I used to think my cat was uncomfortable while in heat but it seems this time has only come off and on in a two week period in the three months I've had her. Perhaps it's selfish, but I like my cats to be somewhat wild and wandering in my fairly good-sized apartment, and even the link you showed me, while it did say cats' personalities don't change with spaying, also said that cats tend to be calmer.

I'm still a bit in the dark more than anything else about the whole issue. More light is welcome. Thanks again.

Chris, Altin Allah'dan (Gold from God), and Okcu (Archer)

[Traci]

For every heat cycle you allow your female cats to endure, elevates the risk for mammary cancer, which IS a common occurance in intact female cats. You do NOT want a kitty to suffer mammary cancer, there is NO cure. Excision and removal of tumors followed by option of chemotherapy are considerations, but they are NOT cures. Most cats succomb to invasive tumors, and other neoplastic conditions and inevitably succomb to death.

Even if your females don't develop mammary cancer, they are at high risk for urinary tract infections, pyometra, urethral infections, and a host of other problems that will indeed be costly to you in the future. These conditions are also not easy on the kitty, imagine the pain, discomfort, inflammation, blood, and bacterial infections that are almost always present in all these conditions.

You are taking a stance that is based on human emotions only, I don't want to sound condescending here, but using human emotions is a selfish action, and your kitties will be the ones who suffer, not you. Also, you cannot with 100% certainty, predict that your cats will not escape, or in the event of an accident, fire, flood or any other environmental disaster, that they won't at some time be in a situation that you cannot control.

You will not find one soul on this forum (or the majority of other forums across the net) who will agree with your rationale toward spaying and neutering, it is the most responsible thing you can do for the health, welfare, happiness and prevention of disease you can ever do for your cats.

[MA]

I have to agree. I do private rescue of wild cats, and recently had an old girl come across my hands. She had a look about her that was not right, and we rushed her in only to find out she had cancer. I never saw her before, but you could tell she was on her last legs. Sometimes they end up here so that their exit out of this world can be better than the life she ended up living, simply because some human was to irresponsible to spay her and spare her from that.

I have also had one who had pyometria- not fun either. She was only 3 years old and the vet said she showed evidence of multiple births. She is now spayed, and comfortable and living on my back porch.

Your best intentions and fiercest desire to keep your cats inside when they are in heat, will fly out the window during Kitten season especially as they grow. I have seen females in heat claw the screens off windows to escape, and although you believe that a heat cycle in not uncomfortable to cats, your thinking is flawed at best. The only relief they can have from it is to mate, and they will do everything they can to get out, even clawing and biting the hand that feeds them.

I urge you to spay your cats, they will get along better if you do, you will have them longer, and the high-cost issue isn't relevant as there are so many low-cost spay and neuter clinics now world-wide. Go to www.savesamoa.org and read and look at the research and find a clinic near you that will help you. Do the responsible thing, the right thing. Come kitty season, if your cats get outside, you may lose them forever. That is to high a risk for someone who loves cats enough to save two of them.

[Turkeycat]

OK, OK ... I'm convinced. I will get my cats spayed as soon as I can, and money is not that important considering the great value spaying has.

However, Traci, you shouldn't put down human emotions because human emotions ... love and the desire for alternative companionship to humans after a lifetime of self-analysis and messed-up relationship experiences ... are what made me take in these animals left on their own on the streeets of a dangerous city of 15 million people and the traffic, stray dogs, and dirt that goes with them. You're right, though, reason should be the dominant force guiding one's decisions regarding what they do with their cats, which is why I've decided to spay after a preponderance of evidence, albeit casually reviewed. I never had a "stance" that was permanent with this.

But I don't mean to dog on you. This site and the people who post on it, including you, have been an absolute godsend to this total newbie to the world of cats, especially a newbie who can barely speak the language of 90 percent of the inhabitants of the country he lives in, including the vets, to find out what to do.

Her sey icin cok tesekkur ederim ve herkes icin kendine iyi bakiniz ... Thanks for everything and everyone take care

Chris

[Traci]

I think you missed my point....you were equating reasons for not spaying with a human emotion, you wanted your cats to "remain wild and wandering" in your apartment, didn't want them "to undergo the knife", and were concerned with their temperaments post-spay. You were given a link to prove the contrary as well as additional educational advice.

If it weren't for human emotions, this board wouldn't exist. It is a constant labor of love, but above all, it is an educational theme. Spay and Neuter education is as vital to feline health and preventative medicine as anything else.

Nowhere was I putting down human emotions, but you did take that out of context in reference to your own human relationship experiences, which truly do not have anything to do with feline health or spay and neuter.

I know I probably should take into consideration that perhaps your country does not view spaying and neutering as crucial as we do here. But, the fact remains, the evidence is there and has been there for years. And, for what it's worth, "evidence-based" is something I feel very strongly about, I apply that in everything I do and take into consideration concerning subjects in these forums.

I'm happy to hear you are getting them spayed, I couldn't be more thrilled with your decision.

[Turkeycat]

Sorry for taking you out of context, Traci. I had my baby spayed last Saturday ... in Turkish it's kisirlastirmak ... egads ... and she has been okay. I'm separating her from my other baby per doctor's orders. Her appetite is down, and her stools are rather soft, but I hear that these things are normal. It's hard to see her uncomfortable from my precautions but I know she'll be better for it in the long run. By the way, the procedure costs twice as much here as it does in the US, and there are no free clinics that I've found in Istanbul, though there is one traveling one based in Fethiye, in the south of Turkey. I wonder if the high cost has to do with how relatively rare a procedure spaying is. Anyway, kendine iyi bak (take care).

[Traci]

Thank you SO much for getting her spayed!! Thank you also for understanding our reasoning...

One thing that concerns me however....you said she was spayed on Saturday but is currently not eating much and has soft stools, neither is common after a spay, except within the first 24 hours post-op. The soft stools could be a result of stress, but I think I would call your vet and ask for a recheck.

Please watch her carefully and examine her incision daily for any of the following signs, which would necessitate an immediate vet visit: redness, swelling, oozing of pus or blood, firm noticeable lump under the incision, sutures pulled at or out, fever, lethargy, inappetance. If any of these are present, don't wait another minute, infection could be present in which antibiotics would be necessary and possible draining and cleansing of the incision.