Attention Traci: Could use your advice
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
just1cat - do you live near college or university with a veterinary school? If this continues to be a mystery, try to see if you can take kitty there.
"A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself." ~ Josh Billings.
Not all bacterial infections can be diagnosed by culture. Some, like the hemobartenella, require blood tests. Can you think back - did anything happen within a few weeks before the onset of symptoms - did you have to pull a tick(or more than one) off of her? Did she bring home her kill to show you. Certain animals carry different diseases, so the type of animal she killed could be relavent. Any wound, even a small one?
"A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself." ~ Josh Billings.
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
Karen and I were talking earlier, and she made a good catch on a condition known as tularemia (I've never personally seen a case of this in a cat, but I live in the northwest), which can be detected with either a blood culture or antibody test - which is yet another good reason to get your vet on the ball and get that serology/immunology profile sent out NOW! That immunology can rule out a large number of vector-borne disease, like tick, flea, other blood parasites.
Can you give us a general idea of your location? (you don't have to be specific, but are you in the US or elsewhere? - northern hemisphere or southern hemisphere?) This could be telling due to the environment, since warm, humid or tropical environments are prime for many vector-borne diseases. Tularemia for example, can be acquired via infected rabbits, fleas, ticks or even ingestion of infected meat/carcasses...
Again, please, tell your vet you want to get blood-borne parasitic infection ruled out with an immunology profile, and since it can take upwards of 5-7 days for results, this needs to be done NOW. Treatment for many of these problems involves tetracyclines or doxycycline, and this could be one reason kitty is not responding to antibiotics, since they may not be targeting something the vet is obviously missing. Karen also makes a good point about consulting with a veterinary university specialist, like virology - even an internal medicine specialist can direct your vet further.
Can you give us a general idea of your location? (you don't have to be specific, but are you in the US or elsewhere? - northern hemisphere or southern hemisphere?) This could be telling due to the environment, since warm, humid or tropical environments are prime for many vector-borne diseases. Tularemia for example, can be acquired via infected rabbits, fleas, ticks or even ingestion of infected meat/carcasses...
Again, please, tell your vet you want to get blood-borne parasitic infection ruled out with an immunology profile, and since it can take upwards of 5-7 days for results, this needs to be done NOW. Treatment for many of these problems involves tetracyclines or doxycycline, and this could be one reason kitty is not responding to antibiotics, since they may not be targeting something the vet is obviously missing. Karen also makes a good point about consulting with a veterinary university specialist, like virology - even an internal medicine specialist can direct your vet further.
..........Traci
I'm sorry to report my wife and I decided to lay kitty to rest this evening. When we arrived at the specialist's office today her temp was nearly 106*. She was delirious. Nothing in the tests stood out to the specialist. The biopsy revealed no findings other than necrotic tissue. We talked about an immunology and he was willing to do it, however all the tests that we thought about getting done were well over a thousand dollars. We had already spent several thousand at this point and can't afford much more. We also have other pets to care for. He also wanted to install a feeding tube to keep her nutrition up while we waited for test results. One or two of the tests we were told could take 2 weeks to return.
I refused the idea of a feeding tube. Kitty came to us as a stray and she had loving care from us and lived out her life the way she wanted it. She ran free and had shelter and all the food she could eat whenever she wanted. It broke our heart to see her suffering these past two weeks and the thought of shoving more meds down her throat and going through test after test also broke our heart. It was not fair for her and you could tell she didn't want it anymore. She was suffering.
Kitty is at peace now and so are we to a certain extent. Part of me wishes we knew what was wrong with her but we just couldn't stand putting her through all this any longer. I lost a cat to renal failure 4 years ago and she had a violent death. For 5 months I gave her SQ fluids daily, shots for anemia and shoved meds down her throat. She had a violent seizure in front us that paralyzed her. I refused to allow kitty the chance for this to happen to her. Just the high persistent fever could have caused her a violent death. Its not fair to her and at this point I think we were thinking about our feelings instead of kitty's.
Some of you may agree or disagree with our decision and thats ok. We felt we did all we could do within our means. At some point you HAVE to make a decision that is best for the animal. I feel we did more and spent more than a majority of pet owners would do, and we were given NO guarantee of finding a cause or cure.
I thank you Traci and K9Karen for your input and advice. I feel more knowledgeable and know where to come in the event of another pet crisis.
With all this said, what do you think about the necrotic tissue in the lymphnodes? And yes, we almost tried doxocycline and predinsone to "buy" time but I explained my reasoning above. I can't change that decision now. Hopefully you guys won't pass judgement.
I refused the idea of a feeding tube. Kitty came to us as a stray and she had loving care from us and lived out her life the way she wanted it. She ran free and had shelter and all the food she could eat whenever she wanted. It broke our heart to see her suffering these past two weeks and the thought of shoving more meds down her throat and going through test after test also broke our heart. It was not fair for her and you could tell she didn't want it anymore. She was suffering.
Kitty is at peace now and so are we to a certain extent. Part of me wishes we knew what was wrong with her but we just couldn't stand putting her through all this any longer. I lost a cat to renal failure 4 years ago and she had a violent death. For 5 months I gave her SQ fluids daily, shots for anemia and shoved meds down her throat. She had a violent seizure in front us that paralyzed her. I refused to allow kitty the chance for this to happen to her. Just the high persistent fever could have caused her a violent death. Its not fair to her and at this point I think we were thinking about our feelings instead of kitty's.
Some of you may agree or disagree with our decision and thats ok. We felt we did all we could do within our means. At some point you HAVE to make a decision that is best for the animal. I feel we did more and spent more than a majority of pet owners would do, and we were given NO guarantee of finding a cause or cure.
I thank you Traci and K9Karen for your input and advice. I feel more knowledgeable and know where to come in the event of another pet crisis.
With all this said, what do you think about the necrotic tissue in the lymphnodes? And yes, we almost tried doxocycline and predinsone to "buy" time but I explained my reasoning above. I can't change that decision now. Hopefully you guys won't pass judgement.
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
I'm so very heartbroken to learn this news. I was praying for a successful diagnosis, treatment and full recovery.
I wouldn't pass judgment on you, but I might on your vets. I think they should have done more definitive testing in the beginning, and, referred you to a specialist in the beginning.
Are you referring to the lymph node biopsy? Necrotic tissue could mean anything from a severe bacterial infection to breakdown of tissue and blood vessels/blood flow due to any number of disease processes. Only a necropsy could determine what truly happened. (Not that I'm suggesting this, I understand fully the emotional aspect of that)
For what it's worth, I don't believe that giving medications and supportive care to a pet is by any means, forceful or uneccessarily harmful, particularly since we have to rely upon bloodwork, labs, symptoms, history etc to tell us what's going on and how to treat effectively - since our pets cannot tell us what we need to know. Sometimes, that involves several medications, sometimes it involves a lengthy treatment, but ultimately we do so to help the pet, and to expect recovery.
I do understand the costs, however, and I realize it can get quite costly in terms of multiple testing. But again, I feel your vets could have done more definitive testing early on, and when they were stumped, should have referred you to a specialist at once. I have a problem with vets who think they can get to the "root" of the problem, but never stop to think how delaying a specialist's opinion can harm the pet and the client.
Depending on your location, I would suggest seeking a new vet for your other pets. (I base this only on your posts of late - and if for any reason you are not happy with your vet(s), it would be most beneficial to your other pets to seek a new one, preferably more experienced in felines and feline medicine).
Please, keep your cats Indoors Only. There are just too many dangers and hazards for cats allowed outdoors, it is relatively simple to provide a safe, happy, healthy and entertaining indoor environment for cats.
I'm so sorry and my heart just breaks for kitty and you, (((((HUGS)))))
I wouldn't pass judgment on you, but I might on your vets. I think they should have done more definitive testing in the beginning, and, referred you to a specialist in the beginning.
Are you referring to the lymph node biopsy? Necrotic tissue could mean anything from a severe bacterial infection to breakdown of tissue and blood vessels/blood flow due to any number of disease processes. Only a necropsy could determine what truly happened. (Not that I'm suggesting this, I understand fully the emotional aspect of that)
For what it's worth, I don't believe that giving medications and supportive care to a pet is by any means, forceful or uneccessarily harmful, particularly since we have to rely upon bloodwork, labs, symptoms, history etc to tell us what's going on and how to treat effectively - since our pets cannot tell us what we need to know. Sometimes, that involves several medications, sometimes it involves a lengthy treatment, but ultimately we do so to help the pet, and to expect recovery.
I do understand the costs, however, and I realize it can get quite costly in terms of multiple testing. But again, I feel your vets could have done more definitive testing early on, and when they were stumped, should have referred you to a specialist at once. I have a problem with vets who think they can get to the "root" of the problem, but never stop to think how delaying a specialist's opinion can harm the pet and the client.
Depending on your location, I would suggest seeking a new vet for your other pets. (I base this only on your posts of late - and if for any reason you are not happy with your vet(s), it would be most beneficial to your other pets to seek a new one, preferably more experienced in felines and feline medicine).
Please, keep your cats Indoors Only. There are just too many dangers and hazards for cats allowed outdoors, it is relatively simple to provide a safe, happy, healthy and entertaining indoor environment for cats.
I'm so sorry and my heart just breaks for kitty and you, (((((HUGS)))))
..........Traci
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
I too can not and will not pass judgement or in any way condemn your decision. I know how hard it was to make it and I fully understand. I am so sorry it turned out this way. Like Traci, I was hoping for good news. My deepest heart-felt condolensces to you and your family.
"A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself." ~ Josh Billings.
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
I would have to agree with you about the vets. It seems they were looking for an obvious problem that any "routine" test would reveal. This wasted time and I have learned a lot from this incident.
We live in a rural area, so specialists are hard to come by. We traveled a hour and a half to the city to visit one. At least they call themselves specialists but who knows.
I too believe giving meds is not harmful and will do it if need be. We just didn't feel confident and weren't given much hope from the vets that things would turn around. Believe me, it was not an easy decision to make. I feared her fever would not break as it never did for the 2 weeks she was being treated. I feared a violent or painful death may have happened from her fever continuing to climb. She was shaky on her feet, it took her several minutes to decide to get up and walk when she needed to. Her third eye lids were constantly showing and it was heart breaking to see her this way.
What bothers me the most is the "what ifs". What was this that got to her, what if we did try this, what if we didn't do this. I hate not knowing what happened.
I prefer indoor cats. We have 2, but kitty showed up as a stray feral. It took some time for her to get used to us. We didn't want to interrupt our other 2 cat's lives by introducing another cat. I'm sure you know how that can sometimes go. We didn't want chance it by taking her to a shelter and risk being out down if she didn't get adopted. Plus she brought 2 of her kittens with her to feed from time to time. Never did know what happened to them.
So in the time she started coming around, she was caring for her young and getting fed from us. We let her do her thing. She continued to hang around and warmed up to us. We got her spayed and vaccinated and let her have our climate controlled garage. We allowed her to live the way she wanted. She would let us know when she wanted to be outside and when she wanted to come in. Once she got accustomed, she stayed in every night and she knew when the weather was bad because she elected to stay inside
. She would go on her adventures during the day but everyday like clock work she would show up just before my wife would return home from work for feeding time. Thats just how we decided to let her live her life. If I would purposely look to adopt a cat, yes it would be an indoor cat. She came to us and we decided to help her any way we could and we did. She got to be cat to put it simple but turned out to be so special. You could tell she appreciated what we did for her and we feel she came to us for a reason.
We live in a rural area, so specialists are hard to come by. We traveled a hour and a half to the city to visit one. At least they call themselves specialists but who knows.
I too believe giving meds is not harmful and will do it if need be. We just didn't feel confident and weren't given much hope from the vets that things would turn around. Believe me, it was not an easy decision to make. I feared her fever would not break as it never did for the 2 weeks she was being treated. I feared a violent or painful death may have happened from her fever continuing to climb. She was shaky on her feet, it took her several minutes to decide to get up and walk when she needed to. Her third eye lids were constantly showing and it was heart breaking to see her this way.
What bothers me the most is the "what ifs". What was this that got to her, what if we did try this, what if we didn't do this. I hate not knowing what happened.
I prefer indoor cats. We have 2, but kitty showed up as a stray feral. It took some time for her to get used to us. We didn't want to interrupt our other 2 cat's lives by introducing another cat. I'm sure you know how that can sometimes go. We didn't want chance it by taking her to a shelter and risk being out down if she didn't get adopted. Plus she brought 2 of her kittens with her to feed from time to time. Never did know what happened to them.
So in the time she started coming around, she was caring for her young and getting fed from us. We let her do her thing. She continued to hang around and warmed up to us. We got her spayed and vaccinated and let her have our climate controlled garage. We allowed her to live the way she wanted. She would let us know when she wanted to be outside and when she wanted to come in. Once she got accustomed, she stayed in every night and she knew when the weather was bad because she elected to stay inside
. She would go on her adventures during the day but everyday like clock work she would show up just before my wife would return home from work for feeding time. Thats just how we decided to let her live her life. If I would purposely look to adopt a cat, yes it would be an indoor cat. She came to us and we decided to help her any way we could and we did. She got to be cat to put it simple but turned out to be so special. You could tell she appreciated what we did for her and we feel she came to us for a reason.-
christymexico
- Posts: 97
- Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:21 am
- Location: mexico
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
I just read about Kitty,,what a lucky cat to have had such a loving Mom and Dad..I know just from your posts how loved she was and I know she felt your love too. I believe they know much more than we think.
Christy
Christy
Re: Attention Traci: Could use your advice
Thank you very much for the kind words.christymexico wrote:I just read about Kitty,,what a lucky cat to have had such a loving Mom and Dad..I know just from your posts how loved she was and I know she felt your love too. I believe they know much more than we think.
Christy