[b] I have a 15 year old cat who has had health (usually liver) problems since she was a kitten. Recently her alkaline phospatase was 700. My vet tells me this is very high and is indicative of some kind of liver disease. We went through 2 courses of antibiotics. It was still high and she was getting much worse -- refusing to eat. I really thought we had lost her. Then he did some research and came up with a supplement -- denamarin that worked wonders. She is eating again. In fact, she begs for food as many as 8-9 times a day and is not satisfied unless I feed her. She may have gained a little weight but not much. She is obviosly happy and content again -- wanting affection and human contact.
We have not retested her yet because she gets very stressed out when blood is taken.
Since she is improving so much, I wonder if there is any other supplement -- treatment that would also help.[/b]
high alkaline phospatase
Re: high alkaline phospatase
Your post is extremely vague and doesn't leave much to the imagination of your vet's competence level.
Your kitty has had some type of liver disfunction since kittenhood? Just what exactly, did your vet or any other vet do to address this THEN? Just what has anyone done exactly to address this over the last 15 years?
WHAT liver disfunction???
What "health problems" has your kitty had all this time that has made her so unhealthy?
Your vet tells you that an elevated ALKP is indicative of "some type of liver disease", but what tests and procedures exactly has he done to appropriately diagnose your kitty??? Has he recommended tests, or have you declined them? Have you sought second opinions?
Btw, stress does not justify not getting proper tests done to identify and properly diagnose a condition in which it could be treated appropriately. Your post indicates kitty has been unhealthy for a number of years and your vet is now telling you there is some liver problem but hasn't specifically diagnosed it? I find this unacceptable in a vet and would strongly advise you seek a new, more experienced vet, immediately, and opt for full testing procedures to get the condition diagnosed specifically, in which to treat it effectively.
Also, kitty begging for food 8-9 times a day is not normal, and she could be literally starving because her liver is compromised, and/or another vital organ function. Proper nutritional therapy is crucial in treating any liver disease. She could also be deydrated, which also puts additional stress and compromise on the liver.
You must understand that there are NUMEROUS diseases that can cause an elevated ALKP, especially when other enzymes are out of range. If other liver enzymes in particular, are also out of range, then your vet needs to be taking a very agressive approach with testing/diagnosis and treatment to prevent further and worsening damage to the liver or other vital organ functions. Testing is CRUCIAL to diagnose specifically.
Some of those diseases can include: Cirrhosis of the liver, biliary stasis or obstruction, hepatic lipidosis, cholangitis, protosystemic liver shunts, diabetes, cushings disease, hypothyroidism, hyperthyroidism, pancreatitis, renal disease, tumors, lymphoma, hemmorhage, osteosarcoma, Regular and followup testing are CRUCIAL to rule each and every disease or secondary disease process out.
It is not new that denemarin or sAME supplements can help the liver, to some degree, but supplements alone are not going to address/treat/prevent/cure a major liver problem. Other treatment is imperative to expect the liver to regenerate or function properly after a major insult, such as toxin, progressive disease, or extended drug use (certain medications used long term). Fluid therapy on a scheduled maintenance or when needed, antibiotic therapy, proper nutritional therapy and sometimes corticosteroids, and other medications are often necessary when treating liver disfunctions. The SOONER the liver condition is diagnosed properly, the SOONER and BETTER a favorable outcome. The liver must be treated appropriately and aggresively in order to expect it to regenerate or function properly. Also, you need testing to ensure that no secondary problems are developing or prohibiting treatment because the secondary problem/condition hasn't been diagnosed and treated properly.
Supplements are just that, they are a supplement, intended only to supplement a specific treatment and should never be used as sole treatment or with the expectation that nothing else is warranted. The supplement, while helpful, is the least of your worries, you need to get testing done to diagnose the liver condition specifically, and treat it agressively! The liver has the potential to fail rapidly, and to degenerate to a serious condition, leaving the patient severely debilitated and at serious risk.
See a new, more experienced, feline-only vet first thing TOMORROW, and get your kitty properly tested and diagnosed immediately, get effective treatment started immediately! You cannot afford to have her lose more weight, nor to have severe electrolyte imbalances, nor worsening and degeneration of a liver condition or any other secondary condition! And the ONLY way to monitor vital organ function is through repeat and followup testing to ensure treatment is effective or to initiate other treatment!
Your kitty has had some type of liver disfunction since kittenhood? Just what exactly, did your vet or any other vet do to address this THEN? Just what has anyone done exactly to address this over the last 15 years?
WHAT liver disfunction???
What "health problems" has your kitty had all this time that has made her so unhealthy?
Your vet tells you that an elevated ALKP is indicative of "some type of liver disease", but what tests and procedures exactly has he done to appropriately diagnose your kitty??? Has he recommended tests, or have you declined them? Have you sought second opinions?
Btw, stress does not justify not getting proper tests done to identify and properly diagnose a condition in which it could be treated appropriately. Your post indicates kitty has been unhealthy for a number of years and your vet is now telling you there is some liver problem but hasn't specifically diagnosed it? I find this unacceptable in a vet and would strongly advise you seek a new, more experienced vet, immediately, and opt for full testing procedures to get the condition diagnosed specifically, in which to treat it effectively.
Also, kitty begging for food 8-9 times a day is not normal, and she could be literally starving because her liver is compromised, and/or another vital organ function. Proper nutritional therapy is crucial in treating any liver disease. She could also be deydrated, which also puts additional stress and compromise on the liver.
You must understand that there are NUMEROUS diseases that can cause an elevated ALKP, especially when other enzymes are out of range. If other liver enzymes in particular, are also out of range, then your vet needs to be taking a very agressive approach with testing/diagnosis and treatment to prevent further and worsening damage to the liver or other vital organ functions. Testing is CRUCIAL to diagnose specifically.
Some of those diseases can include: Cirrhosis of the liver, biliary stasis or obstruction, hepatic lipidosis, cholangitis, protosystemic liver shunts, diabetes, cushings disease, hypothyroidism, hyperthyroidism, pancreatitis, renal disease, tumors, lymphoma, hemmorhage, osteosarcoma, Regular and followup testing are CRUCIAL to rule each and every disease or secondary disease process out.
It is not new that denemarin or sAME supplements can help the liver, to some degree, but supplements alone are not going to address/treat/prevent/cure a major liver problem. Other treatment is imperative to expect the liver to regenerate or function properly after a major insult, such as toxin, progressive disease, or extended drug use (certain medications used long term). Fluid therapy on a scheduled maintenance or when needed, antibiotic therapy, proper nutritional therapy and sometimes corticosteroids, and other medications are often necessary when treating liver disfunctions. The SOONER the liver condition is diagnosed properly, the SOONER and BETTER a favorable outcome. The liver must be treated appropriately and aggresively in order to expect it to regenerate or function properly. Also, you need testing to ensure that no secondary problems are developing or prohibiting treatment because the secondary problem/condition hasn't been diagnosed and treated properly.
Supplements are just that, they are a supplement, intended only to supplement a specific treatment and should never be used as sole treatment or with the expectation that nothing else is warranted. The supplement, while helpful, is the least of your worries, you need to get testing done to diagnose the liver condition specifically, and treat it agressively! The liver has the potential to fail rapidly, and to degenerate to a serious condition, leaving the patient severely debilitated and at serious risk.
See a new, more experienced, feline-only vet first thing TOMORROW, and get your kitty properly tested and diagnosed immediately, get effective treatment started immediately! You cannot afford to have her lose more weight, nor to have severe electrolyte imbalances, nor worsening and degeneration of a liver condition or any other secondary condition! And the ONLY way to monitor vital organ function is through repeat and followup testing to ensure treatment is effective or to initiate other treatment!
..........Traci
Re: high alkaline phospatase
Thank you so much for your reply! The information is vague because that is all I have. All Cassaundra's life, 3 or 4 times a year she would look not healhy to me. Tests would show the Alk-Phos one was high every time My vet would prescribe antibiotics and it would go away. It has never been this high however.
I have never been given an actual name for her problem. I don't know if I can explain the other fact I know well, but here is what I understand. Sometime before I rescued her, tests show she was explosed to FTP. That was picked up the very first time I took her to the vet at approximately 2 months of age ( my guess). My vet said she has never had FTP -- just been exposed. I don't know if that has any effect on the liver or not.
Those are the health problems she has had. I googled feline liver problems and all the conditions you mentioned came up but I have not been told that has specifically any of them -- Just liver disease.
I have been wondering if she needs a second opinion myself so thank you for suggesting it; What really irritated me was that the supplement was not suggested sooner. It has really turned her life around. I had to ask if there was not something else we could do. That is what caused me to wonder if there was not something else besides that could be done.
The begging for food seems awfully like a cat I had several years ago who had hyperthyroidisn. I asked to have that tested for. That test was negative.
I will make an appointment at a feline only vet here in town. I am also very close to a veterinary school of medicine. I have taken animals there before. I could do it again. This may sound strange but I keep getting the feeling that my vet has given up on her since she is 15 years old.
Thankyou again. You confirmed what I suspected.
I have never been given an actual name for her problem. I don't know if I can explain the other fact I know well, but here is what I understand. Sometime before I rescued her, tests show she was explosed to FTP. That was picked up the very first time I took her to the vet at approximately 2 months of age ( my guess). My vet said she has never had FTP -- just been exposed. I don't know if that has any effect on the liver or not.
Those are the health problems she has had. I googled feline liver problems and all the conditions you mentioned came up but I have not been told that has specifically any of them -- Just liver disease.
I have been wondering if she needs a second opinion myself so thank you for suggesting it; What really irritated me was that the supplement was not suggested sooner. It has really turned her life around. I had to ask if there was not something else we could do. That is what caused me to wonder if there was not something else besides that could be done.
The begging for food seems awfully like a cat I had several years ago who had hyperthyroidisn. I asked to have that tested for. That test was negative.
I will make an appointment at a feline only vet here in town. I am also very close to a veterinary school of medicine. I have taken animals there before. I could do it again. This may sound strange but I keep getting the feeling that my vet has given up on her since she is 15 years old.
Thankyou again. You confirmed what I suspected.
Re: high alkaline phospatase
Kudos to you for looking at getting a second opinion. I too sometimes think certain vets 'give up' because of a cat's age.
When I was fostering Velcro for the small humane society here, he had some jaundice. The first thing we did was have a full blood chemistry panel done. His liver values were off (can't recall exact numbers as that has been a bit), but the vet said they could be an indicator of liver disease, a tumor of the liver, or a long-standing infection that had gone untreated (he was a stray that had showed up on my front porch, approx 1 year old at the time).
At that time we chose to tackle the infection theory first, and he was put on antibiotics.
The jaundice disappeared, and his liver values returned to normal after the round of antibiotics was finished.
His liver values have remained normal since then, and he's a very happy, healthy, and spoiled kitty these days.
Had the antibiotics NOT worked and liver values remained abnormal, I definitely would have pursued further testing to find a definitive diagnosis.
Good luck, and please keep us posted!
When I was fostering Velcro for the small humane society here, he had some jaundice. The first thing we did was have a full blood chemistry panel done. His liver values were off (can't recall exact numbers as that has been a bit), but the vet said they could be an indicator of liver disease, a tumor of the liver, or a long-standing infection that had gone untreated (he was a stray that had showed up on my front porch, approx 1 year old at the time).
At that time we chose to tackle the infection theory first, and he was put on antibiotics.
The jaundice disappeared, and his liver values returned to normal after the round of antibiotics was finished.
His liver values have remained normal since then, and he's a very happy, healthy, and spoiled kitty these days.
Had the antibiotics NOT worked and liver values remained abnormal, I definitely would have pursued further testing to find a definitive diagnosis.
Good luck, and please keep us posted!
I'm assuming you mean FIP (feline infectious peritonitis), but I have to ask, what tests exactly were done to lead the vet to suspect kitty was exposed to FIP? Was it because the prior owner actually had a FIP-positive cat on the premises, or what? There are specific PCR tests available to test for FIP, but unfortunately, they only detect the presence of a coronavirus, they are not specific for FIP unless the cat has typical clinical symptoms, bloodwork and other diagnostics suggest FIP, or a consistent coronavirus titer are high upon repeated testing. FIP is lethal and an FIP-infected cat unfortunately will not survive once clinical symptoms develop.
Also, testing a kitten at 2 months of age wouldn't be a sole diagnostic indicator, the tests, including FELV and FIV testing should have been repeated as she matured, so that maternal antibodies could have been ruled out, and so that other conditions could be ruled out.
Has kitty been tested for FELV/FIV, and if so, how often?
How many times would you say, over the years, has kitty had full blood profiling, and has any other enzyme been out of range? If the ALKP was consistently out of range every time, why the heck didn't the vet persue this further? Did you decline further testing? By "high", was the ALKP in the high normal range, or actually over the normal range, meaning, off the charts? For example, if the ALKP was within the high normal range, this might have been somewhat normal for her in particular, but if it was out of range, off the charts, then the vet should have persued additional testing and ruled out all of the conditions I noted above.
Since you have a veterinary university nearby, I find it appalling your vet never consulted them all this time. He could have done so numerous times over the years to address the health problems and get to the underlying cause. It was INCUMBENT upon him to do so, and upon realizing his inabilities, he was obligated to refer you to another vet with more experience. This alone should tell you that he isn't comitted to your kitty's health and care, and has essentially failed her and you. Granted, I don't know what tests have been done, nor the true results of those tests over the years, nor his findings, but according to your posts, his answer was always just to prescribe antibiotics. That is treating blindly, and after the second or third health problem, he should have known better, he should have persued this agressively.
It should NEVER matter the age of the cat, we strive to provide our senior cats with the best possible care to diagnose, treat, manage a health condition to provide exceptional care. Senior pet care and treatment is just as important as that for young or adult cats!
Your kitty deserves much better, please see a qualified feline-only vet or see the veterinary university specialists TODAY, get ALL of kitty's health records faxed to them immediately (or they can do this on your behalf), and get a proper diagnosis and treatment initiated immediately!!
Also, testing a kitten at 2 months of age wouldn't be a sole diagnostic indicator, the tests, including FELV and FIV testing should have been repeated as she matured, so that maternal antibodies could have been ruled out, and so that other conditions could be ruled out.
Has kitty been tested for FELV/FIV, and if so, how often?
How many times would you say, over the years, has kitty had full blood profiling, and has any other enzyme been out of range? If the ALKP was consistently out of range every time, why the heck didn't the vet persue this further? Did you decline further testing? By "high", was the ALKP in the high normal range, or actually over the normal range, meaning, off the charts? For example, if the ALKP was within the high normal range, this might have been somewhat normal for her in particular, but if it was out of range, off the charts, then the vet should have persued additional testing and ruled out all of the conditions I noted above.
Since you have a veterinary university nearby, I find it appalling your vet never consulted them all this time. He could have done so numerous times over the years to address the health problems and get to the underlying cause. It was INCUMBENT upon him to do so, and upon realizing his inabilities, he was obligated to refer you to another vet with more experience. This alone should tell you that he isn't comitted to your kitty's health and care, and has essentially failed her and you. Granted, I don't know what tests have been done, nor the true results of those tests over the years, nor his findings, but according to your posts, his answer was always just to prescribe antibiotics. That is treating blindly, and after the second or third health problem, he should have known better, he should have persued this agressively.
It should NEVER matter the age of the cat, we strive to provide our senior cats with the best possible care to diagnose, treat, manage a health condition to provide exceptional care. Senior pet care and treatment is just as important as that for young or adult cats!
Your kitty deserves much better, please see a qualified feline-only vet or see the veterinary university specialists TODAY, get ALL of kitty's health records faxed to them immediately (or they can do this on your behalf), and get a proper diagnosis and treatment initiated immediately!!
..........Traci