Bladder Stones

[Traci]

Candice, you can check our Dietary Pages for links to all the major veterinary brand companies....

If you cant find Purina's ingredients, let me know and I can post them here.

[Candycane]

Thanks for the link...that is a great resource. According to that page, it looks like Purina only makes a diet for struvite stones so the ingredients won't be needed.

How much do you know about the Medi-Cal Reduced Protein? It is indicated for oxalate crystals. I had my male on the Hypoallergenic formula for awhile and while he didn't eat it readily, it was palatable.

[Traci]

Actually, the Purina NF can be used for oxalate conditions, much like the Medi-Cal Reduced Protein.

Again, first and foremost is confirming with your vet the diagnosed urate....example: struvites may be comprised of magnesium ammonium phosphate...as opposed to the triple phosphates which may be comprised of amorphous phosphates, calcium and oxalate. Assuming because your vet commented on acidic urine, then oxalates were the diagnosis (along with sediment/slide exam and identification of the stone structure upon slide exam), then the diet you would choose would be oxalate-specific.

Truthfully, there isn't much of a difference in ingredients between Medi-Cal's Reduced Protein and Purina's NF, providing you're reading the ingredients for canned only. They both have meat by-products, fish sources, etc with the exception that Medi-Cal doesn't use corn. (btw, corn allergies are most often a problem with dogs rather than cats)

If you're conscientious, then opt for the Medical, but run it by your vet (or preferrably one more experienced in feline nutrition, heh), and be absolutely certain you know the exact type of stone diagnosis before ordering the food.

Again, palatablility may be an issue, for this reason, I suggested trying to get samples of one or two different veterinary diets. Owners must sometimes need to change the veterinary brand simply because their cat refused to eat it, therefore switching to another brand becomes necessary.

[Candycane]

Thanks Traci.
I don't think that palatability will be a problem with the cat in question, especially if I use the canned food. When Max was on the hypoallergenic, Syd ate it willingly. She doesn't like human food, but will beg for cat food. I may go back into the vet who did the ultrasound (in the next city) and pick up some samples. They had a fairly extensive selection.

I am also going to look at the results myself when I go into the office and see exactly what was found. I also want to look at the specific gravity from the last urinalysis to see if she was getting enough water. The vet said it was "normal"...but I would like to see a value. I know that it will be low on this urinalysis simply because she has been fighting this for months.

[Traci]

I don't think you should be overly concerned about the specific gravity at this point. If your vet said it was normal and didn't observe any other signs of dehydration, etc., then it should be just fine.

For reference, increased SG can result from decreased water intake, anorexia, dehydration, shock. A decrease in SG could result from more serious conditions such as severe infection, diabetes, liver disease, heavily increased water consumption, renal disease and some types of medications (like diuretics).

Lastly, one urine sample varies from another when measuring SG, dependent upon when the sample was collected/tested, environmental temperature, eating/drinking habits. Concentrated urine is most often seen in an early morning sample, which could result in a slightly higher than normal SG, but is not always alarming. You'd also want to pay attention to glucose, ketones, etc if abnormally high or consistently high.

[Candycane]

From my understanding, the specific gravity should be around 1.020 normally. So even if water consumption is increased, it should remain the same?

[Traci]

Depending on the lab reference range, every vet seems to have a variation in their lab ranges...typically, anywhere from 1.015-1.060 could be considered normal, providing the patient has no other specific health problems.

A slight increase in water consumption may not affect the SG at all, it is during severe dehydration, shock or otherwise where an increase in SG would be of concern because you'd want to know where the water loss is occuring (i.e., renal insufficiency, diabetes-increased water consumption more than normal-, through vomiting/diarrhea, losses through an episode of shock, etc). If your kitty has not had a serious dehydration problem as a result of her prior history, don't rely on SG alone to monitor. When performing urinalyses, of course, SG is combined, but should never be used as the sole diagnostic.

[Candycane]

I definitely am not going to use it as a sole diagnostic, I just thought it would give me some insight into whether or not she is getting enough fluids or if we should start with the syringe. My hasn't called yet (he's still out on the farms ) but he will probably just call me at home tonight. I will let you know what he says. In your experience, what are the chances that the oxalate stones will be dissolved by the diet? I have read in several places that surgery is the only option for these types of stones. Is that because the diet has a poor success rate?

[Traci]

That's a tough question and it depends on the individual case. Only my opinion, but if the stones are small enough and there's a slight chance they may be slightly dissolvable through diet and can pass safely through the urethra, then it's worth a shot. One problem you might encounter is scarring or inflammed bladder wall or thickening, which may not allow for passing a stone. But, this is where monitoring comes in, through urinalysis, observation of her urination habits, and monitoring that hematuria (+/- x-ray to monitor stone size)

Triple phosphates are tough enough as it is to manage, they are more difficult than struvites. However, if caught early enough (size and number), if diet produces results, it will give you a better indication toward a future dietary management approach. If it becomes necessary to proceed with surgery, and if it's sucessful, then you still want to follow through with a proper dietary approach to help prevent it from occuring again.

[LisaLisa]

Hi,

Just want to bring up one more point here for you..if you feed your both cats the same food, please talk to your vet about the prescription diet options available.

Like Jason's cat Rocky, my Smokey needed to have p/u surgery. He has calcium oxalate crystals and needed to be on a prescription diet too. I wanted to find a food that both Smokey and Caz (who was 2 1/2 years old at the time) could eat. The people at Hill's felt that Caz would be at risk for developing struvite crystals if he were to eat Smokey's food.

I ended up feeding them both Walthams....

Good luck to you...