Need help, encouragement and advice please!

[wildorchid78]

Hi, I'm new here and I decided to leave a message in hopes that someone can help me out. I have 4 cats, 2 males (neutered) 2 female(just had them neutered). I have the mom and dad and their two kittens. They have always gotten along very well Last week one of my female cats Mitzi was sleeping with me. This is something she usually doesn't do but I figured since she was in heat she was just being different. Mikki, one of my males cats, who is more of a people cat and never pays attention to any of the other cats usually sleeps with me. I was half asleep and i felt him jump up on the bed. I think he accidently jumped directly on to Mitzi not knowing she was there. they both jumped off and within seconds there was loud yelling and hissing and every nasty sound a cat makes when they're mad. I seperated them for maybe an hour and thought things were ok only to be woken up by them going at it again. The instigator is mitzi, which is shocking because she was always so acceptable of the other cats and even when I brought home a kitten to take care of she never was aggressive. So we left them seperated for the rest of the night and let them out in the morning only for mitzi to attack mikki again. My family went nuts and told me to take care of this problem otherwise mitzi had to go. I took her to the vet, told him what happend and he said because she was in heat her emotions are uncontrollable and she lashed out because he invaded her space. I left her there over the weekend and asked for her to be spayed on monday. She ended up having an ovarian cyst to top it all off. So tuesday she came home. In the meantime the other female cat had pyometra and she had surgery the same day too. quite a mess I know. Well since then mitzi gets along fine with my other two cats but freaks out every time she saw mikki and attacked him. She never hurt him though, no scratch, bite etc. He gets over the attacks quickly and is ready to roam around within minutes. She is still displaying signs of being in heat and so is the other female cat. Is this normal if you spay a cat while she is in heat? although my other cat wasn't in heat when she got spayed. I am so upset that my cats don't get along. They are my kids and I love them all to pieces but constantly having to let one out and keep one seperated doesn't seem like something I can do forever in a two bedroom apartment. I don't want them to be the best of friends because they never were. I just want mitizi to stop attacking mikki. I got the flower essences, and it seemed like it has done nothing to calm mitizi down as far as the meowing and trying to get out of the room. I haven't sleep for two days because she meows all night at the door of my room to get out. She seems to be very attached to the other female right now and she's quiet when they're together. Should I wait until her heat symptoms have gone away to try to reintroduce Mitzi and Mikki? I am waiting on some feliway and some feliway plug ins to come in next week and I'm hoping this will help. Please I hope that some of you out there can help me out, offer me some encouragement because if they don't stop fighting mitzi will have to go and i can't even think of not having her around. I have been crying for a week straight about this and I just want to know if there is any hope. Sorry this is such a long post.

[LisaLisa]

Hi,

I'm so sorry you are going through this with your kitties. I know it is very stressful when your kitties are not getting along and you are dealing with medical problems too.

Please see recent posts by Susan and the girls to give you some ideas about other things you may do such as time-outs, supervised interactions, etc.. There are alot of posts on this site from others who have gone through this. I'd be the first to say that I have no idea about the impact of your cat being in heat and this behavior. Maybe someone else can address this for you. I also don't know if possibly Mitzi is reacting this way to Mikki because he is a male. It may be worth a try to keep these two separated for awhile until Mitzi's hormones calm down a bit. When I had my cat Caz neutered, it took him about a month for his hormones to get into check.

How is Mitzi doing other wise...eating, drinking, bathroom habits, any signs of an infection, does she seem like she is in any pain...that may warrant a call/visit to your vet??

I hope this helps...

[Traci]

First, I doubt hormones had much to do with this....but rather it seems Mikki actually might have harmed Mitzi by jumping on her (and no one but your vet knows if she might have been painful in her abdomen due to that cyst before the spay)...if that was the case, then she would have normally reacted that way toward Mikki.

Second, after the spay of both females, since they need to recuperate, they are sensitive to the other cats, meaning they want to be left alone (think of this in terms as if you had surgery, you wouldn't want anyone near you, should someone brush up against you, bump into you, etc, causing you pain). The two females should have a seperate area in which to retreat and recover from the spays (usually, 7 days are needed to fully recover from soreness, etc). Plus, the female with pyometra: this is a serious infection and she was probably very ill, which the other cats can sense and therefore will cause some amount of stress in the environment. (please be sure you are closely monitoring the females, their incision sites, and watch for any signs of infection, bruising, leaking of blood or pus, fever or lethargy, in which case see your vet promptly....keep an especially close eye on the female with the pyometra)

If the cats were spayed while in the heat cycle, the heat behavior could continue for yet a few days or even about a month post-op, this is normal.

You have to give this alittle time, especially time for the females to heal and recover fully (they need a safe and private, quiet area)....and if fighting ensues, then seperate them for short periods of time, the instigator should be the one confined for a few minutes at a time. If repeated time-outs are necessary, this will be sufficient for him/her to learn you will not give extra attention to that cat and they will learn that a time-out is not that fun.

[wildorchid78]

thank you for your replies I really appreciate it. As far as their incisions go they are looking good. they aren't lethargic at all, in fact at times i wish they'd be a little bit more calm. I haven't let mikki and mitzi see each other at all for about 2 days now. I don't know if this is the right thing to do or not. To be quite honest I'm really scared to have them anywhere near each other. I rotate them throughout the rooms in the apartment every couple of hours. I don't want mitzi to get agitated since she had the surgery. I never thought that maybe if he actually did jump on her that it could of hurt her because of the cyst. I don't know but are cysts painful? hope that doesn't sound stupid. my cat with pyometra seems to be eating quite well and so is mitizi. so is it better to let them see each other a couple of times a day and seperate if they start fighting? or keep them seperated a few more days and then try again? mitizi is hard to control once she starts and she even bit my mom's leg pretty bad the first night this happend. *sigh* I just want peace.
PS Sorry I posted again traci.

[Traci]

If I misunderstood, my apologies, I thought you mentioned Mitzi and your other female got along ok...if this is the case, there is no harm in allowing those two together...since they are both recovering from surgery, they would probably not be inclined to fight.

As for the cyst, yes, it can be painful, depending on the location and if there was inflammation prior to the spay. It can also be slightly painful during recovery from the spay, so reduced activity is important for both females until at least 7 days post-op, and to ensure that if removable sutures were used, that the kitties don't pull them out (keep an eye on them daily, and if you notice one or more sutures missing and there is an opening at the inicision site as a result, contact your vet promptly.).....Dissolvable sutures won't be a problem unless either cat develops a reaction to them, in which case, the signs I noted earlier should be watched for carefully and a prompt vet visit would be warranted.

I think that if you can keep the two females in a safe, quiet area long enough for them to rest and recover, the situation should return to normal in due time. In the meantime, try to keep Mikki at bay until the recovery is complete.

[MA]

A couple of things that help when there is antagonism in the room is to invest in a Comfort Zone Room diffuser by Farnum Pet and Feliway. The initial unit is a bit spendy (especially if you are watching your pennies) but you can shop around the internet to find the best buy on it. What it does, is you plug it into an outlet in the room most likely to invite confrontation and it releases non-stop pheremones in the air and cools down the stress level. I must admit I was skeptical when I first bought mine about 8 months ago, but it has paid off in spades and even quelled a dispute between two long-time alpha females who until after the unit was installed, seemed to never get along.

Traci is right, (as always) when a cat is stressed it sheds an unusual scent and that can trigger the others to thinking a strange cat is in the area- even though they can't see them, they smell something *different* A favorite trick of mine to stop this smell from taking over the situation is to take some vanilla extract, not much and put it under each cat's chin, between their shoulder blades and at the base of their tail 3 times a day. Just dip your finger in the stuff and apply it that way. Or, if you wear a certain perfume all the time and your cats are comfortable with it- spray your perfume in the air, thrust your arms into the spray and rub briskly. Wave your arms to dry any residue, then stroke all the cats. Don't ever just spray the perfume directly on your cat that is courting disaster.

Good luck with the two recovering right now-

[wildorchid78]

yeah, the two females get along well, i can't seperate them actually. I guess they both know they are going through a tough time together. I'm glad to hear that the comfort zone plug ins work because I ordered two from petsmart along with some feliway spray. I think i'm going to give it a few more days till i let them meet. or maybe i'll try tomorrow if i'm not too scared. I stayed home the whole week with them but tomorrow I have to get back to work so I hope they won't cause chaos in the bedroom. I'm starting to feel a little bit better now that I was able to communicate with people who can give me some advice. I have a feeling that they sense my tension as well and it might not be helpful. thanks so much guys. I'll give you updates on how things are going once i try to bring them face to face again. no one answered my question though if it's ok to keep them apart a few days as opposed to having them meet daily. thanks again everyone

[Traci]

To answer your question, only you can determine that....if you feel it is necessary to keep them apart, by all means, do so, but if you are referring to the two females, it probably isn't necessary. Play it by ear today, allow them in the same room/area together and see how it goes for today. If they do not fight, then they should do ok from here on in. If they do fight, then the time-outs for short periods of time might work. If you are referring to Mikki's presence with them, if he is being agressive in any way, then he should be the one with the time-outs.

No one can say for sure what will happen when you are at work. Confining two cats in the same room might spell disaster, or it might not, it depends on the situation and the individuals.

[wildorchid78]

there is no aggression between mitizi and the other female sookie. they do good and are quiet when they're together so I keep them together. the problem is between mitzi and mikki and it was always mitzi who attacked mikki after the incident on the bed. I think i'll keep them apart for today and make an attempt tomorrow and try the short time outs again. mitzi and mikki never hung out together but they never had a problem either. they wouldn't even hiss at each other. and i think i just went through a big shock because mitzi was always such a calm and accepting cat who never gave me any problems.

[wildorchid78]

I just noticed i said I had my female cats neutered instead of spayed in my first post! duh, no wonder people didn't want to answer my post it hardly made sense! you can tell the toll this is taking on me.